Landing and staying upright - majority consensus vs minority

[FastEddieB]

One other thing:

 

I'm reviewing the new ACS for Private Pilot in anticipation of my CFI renewal ride.

 

The language about touchdown speed has changed just a bit from the PTS.

 

PTS: 8. Touches down smoothly at approximate stalling speed.

 

ACS: 8. Touch down smoothly at a speed that provides little or no aerodynamic lift.

 

Not sure why the change in the language, which seems on the surface to be just a different way to say essentially the same thing.

 

Perhaps it may be because some aircraft configurations don't actually ever "stall", so that "stalling speed" might not apply to some aircraft?

[ralarcon]

Tom,

 

Fully agree about the careless use of language leading to misunderstandings. I was about to post something similar.

 

Anyway, pretty sure by this time everyone knows which "side" I'm on. You and I and CT and a few others are all on the same page.

 

But in the interest of full disclosure, let's take a peek at what the Airplane Flying Handbook actually recommends (I've highlighted the pertinent part):

 

TURBULENT AIR

APPROACH AND LANDING

Power-on approaches at an airspeed slightly above the normal approach speed should be used for landing in turbulent air. This provides for more positive control of the airplane when strong horizontal wind gusts, or up and down drafts, are experienced. Like other power-on approaches (when the pilot can vary the amount of power), a coordinated combination of both pitch and power adjustments is usually required. As in most other landing approaches, the proper approach attitude and airspeed require a minimum roundout and should result in little or no floating during the landing.

To maintain good control, the approach in turbulent air with gusty crosswind may require the use of partial wing flaps. With less than full flaps, the airplane will be in a higher pitch attitude. Thus, it will require less of a pitch change to establish the landing attitude, and the touchdown will be at a higher airspeed to ensure more positive control. The speed should not be so excessive that the airplane will float past the desired landing area.

One procedure is to use the normal approach speed plus one-half of the wind gust factors. If the normal speed is 70 knots, and the wind gusts increase 15 knots, airspeed of 77 knots is appropriate. In any case, the airspeed and the amount of flaps should be as the airplane manufacturer recommends.

An adequate amount of power should be used to maintain the proper airspeed and descent path throughout the approach, and the throttle retarded to idling position only after the main wheels contact the landing surface. Care must be exercised in closing the throttle before the pilot is ready for touchdown. In this situation, the sudden or premature closing of the throttle may cause a sudden increase in the descent rate that could result in a hard landing.

Landings from power approaches in turbulence should be such that the touchdown is made with the airplane in approximately level flight attitude. The pitch attitude at touchdown should be only enough to prevent the nosewheel from contacting the surface before the main wheels have touched the surface. After touchdown, the pilot should avoid the tendency to apply forward pres- sure on the yoke as this may result in wheelbarrowing and possible loss of control. The airplane should be allowed to decelerate normally, assisted by careful use of wheel brakes. Heavy braking should be avoided until the wings are devoid of lift and the airplane’s full weight is resting on the landing gear.

 

That said, many pilots seem to confuse a straight crosswind with a turbulent air approach and landing, resulting in speeds far in excess of what's needed. And to misread "1/2 of the gust factor" as "1/2 of the crosswind". For instance, 16G22 would only call for a 3 kt increase in approach speed, while in my experience many pilots would add 10 kts or more in that situation.

 

In the following post I'll link a video that I think is relevant.

Again totally agree , and said much more eloquently than I ever could. Thanks !

 

Cheers

[Ed Cesnalis]

I fly in Nevada too.  If I don't add a little speed in high winds I can't make the runway.  And once over the runway I can't get down without a thump.  The wind makes sure  there is no excess speed on the ground, why?  Because all the speed is bled off before touchdown due to the headwind/cross wind once the throttle is brought to idle.

 

But I know this is going to end up in a back and forth so let me end my part in this thread by saying, each to his own.

 

 

'Steady State', 'relative wind',  You need to understand these terms.

• If I don't add a little speed in high winds I can't make the runway.   -  You can make the runway at any speed that is greater than the headwind component.  In other words the high winds are not a factor  in terms of making the runway.
• And once over the runway I can't get down without a thump. - Vertical speed control at the end of the landing sequence does not change with steady state winds. Use the throttle to lessen your vertical speed if necesarry.
• Because all the speed is bled off before touchdown due to the headwind/cross wind once the throttle is brought to idle. - Bringing the throttle to idle does not effect your speed.  Set the stab to set your speed, use trim to set speed on approach.  The speed doesn't bleed off by itself you have to raise the nose for that. Or at least close the throttle and prevent the nose from lowering.

PS  we never finished this conversation from 2 years ago.