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How do i get my ctsw flaps "changed" to get -12


kentuckynet
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I know ill get a few people saying insurance, flight design, blah blah blah....

 

Along time ago I was told over the phone how to change my flap setting to -12, well im ready to do it.

I have the items i was told to get from flight design, the little rocker switch and something else i think.

When i was at page a new friend tried to turn my flap control knob in a direction it did not want to go into....Wound up turning the whole unit, i was able to get it lined up later.

 

So all is back like it was and now i need some directions...

 

Anyone care to help?

 

I know it wont go much faster but i still want to do it....remeber im ELSA now.

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I know ill get a few people saying insurance, flight design, blah blah blah....

 

Along time ago I was told over the phone how to change my flap setting to -12, well im ready to do it.

I have the items i was told to get from flight design, the little rocker switch and something else i think.

When i was at page a new friend tried to turn my flap control knob in a direction it did not want to go into....Wound up turning the whole unit, i was able to get it lined up later.

 

So all is back like it was and now i need some directions...

 

Anyone care to help?

 

I know it wont go much faster but i still want to do it....remeber im ELSA now.

 

I know this is some of the blah blah blah you didn't want, but it will take it out of the LSA catergory because the clean stall speed will be to high. That is the reason we don't have the -12 here.

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Tom, you are correct. Changing the flaps to -12 is not in compliance with LSA. -12 is what they use in Europe.

 

I have a few customers who's planes always come in with the flaps at -12. I have to put them back to -6. For some reason they keep going back to -12, HMMMMMMMMM.

 

Changing the flaps back only takes a few minutes. I bet it would only take 20 minutes to change them to -12..........if we were in Europe.

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Thats what i was waiting for....blah blah blah....

 

Not sure what ever happened to just flying, to hell with the rest.

 

I flew 25 years without a pilot license and by choice i got them not becuase i was told too.

 

In my area no one ever checks for anyhting...its a really nice place to live.

 

Thanks anyway ill get it figured out

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Mac, some of us have to follow the rules because that is how we make a living. For you it is just a hobby, but if someone moved into your town selling septic systems cheaper than you because they were not following the code you would be hollering about the rules then. If you want to go to -12 flaps then go for it, but your E-LSA will not be eligble as an LSA anymore if you get caught.

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You are correct it still burns me up when other people dont follow the rules that i follow on septics, but once again here where i live rules are just not enforced on anyhting other than speeding, drugs, rape and murder....i try and stay away from those!!!

 

I do understand though,

 

I am curious about one thing though...what kind of idiot would ever have -12 flaps and be flying slow??? Why???

 

mack

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You are correct it still burns me up when other people dont follow the rules that i follow on septics, but once again here where i live rules are just not enforced on anyhting other than speeding, drugs, rape and murder....i try and stay away from those!!!

 

I do understand though,

 

I am curious about one thing though...what kind of idiot would ever have -12 flaps and be flying slow??? Why???

 

mack

 

what about landing after an electrical system failure or flap malfunction.

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  • 10 years later...

They would have to be reset and configured and the safety wire relocated.

BUT I did a study on it back in 2007 with 4 CTSW’s and it isn’t worth it. Plus at high altitude you’d have to go back to zero flaps due to loss of lift. I did that study with 5 CT’s at 12k. They all got to fly in -6, but at -12 you had to hold the stick way back and use a lot of throttle to try and keep altitude.

Leave your -6 alone. Sometimes reported mods aren’t worth it and people fail to scientifically research all unintended consequences.

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Jim, I'm sorry, but is one of the few things I have not had to do, so I'm not much help.

36 minutes ago, Roger Lee said:

They would have to be reset and configured and the safety wire relocated.

BUT I did a study on it back in 2007 with 4 CTSW’s and it isn’t worth it. Plus at high altitude you’d have to go back to zero flaps due to loss of lift. I did that study with 5 CT’s at 12k. They all got to fly in -6, but at -12 you had to hold the stick way back and use a lot of throttle to try and keep altitude.

Leave your -6 alone. Sometimes reported mods aren’t worth it and people fail to scientifically research all unintended consequences.

Roger, Jim drug up an old post from 2011 with a similar, but unrelated question. He had to change a potentiometer, and needs to reprogram the flaps. I don't think he wants to go to -12° flaps. 

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2 hours ago, Roger Lee said:

They would have to be reset and configured and the safety wire relocated.

BUT I did a study on it back in 2007 with 4 CTSW’s and it isn’t worth it. Plus at high altitude you’d have to go back to zero flaps due to loss of lift. I did that study with 5 CT’s at 12k. They all got to fly in -6, but at -12 you had to hold the stick way back and use a lot of throttle to try and keep altitude.

Leave your -6 alone. Sometimes reported mods aren’t worth it and people fail to scientifically research all unintended consequences.

Roger,

I have a growing suspicion that the aircraft that came from the factory with -12 degrees were also rigged to have their ailerons reflexed more than the -6 degree aircraft. In fact if you look at the rigging and deflection specs for the 2 different aircraft there is a different zero point called out of the alerions. 

 

image.png.79116319a16cecf59bf42d82a41349b3.png

image.png.478aeed5ee834dd6ee23eeaebe9d845a.png

 

I have seen a LSA CTSW with -12 flaps and the alerions are not set equal to that degree. 

 

So if you claim that the -12 flaps does not do much, what about the gentleman that is on here from (i think) France that says he get 135knot cruise speeds? (It was on a recent post, which i cannot find)

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I have reset many a flap on CT’s. Yes they have come from the factory at different actual settings that were indicated on the panel. I have reset most of them to the actual reading on the panel. I have rigged 5 CT’s with -12 and flown them side by side and side by side with -6 flap CT’s. It isn’t worth doing and for the claim of 135 knots, hogwash. They may have forgot to mention the tailwind. Not a one was ever even close and that was even using different props.

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15 minutes ago, Roger Lee said:

I have reset many a flap on CT’s. Yes they have come from the factory at different actual settings that were indicated on the panel. I have reset most of them to the actual reading on the panel. I have rigged 5 CT’s with -12 and flown them side by side and side by side with -6 flap CT’s. It isn’t worth doing and for the claim of 135 knots, hogwash. They may have forgot to mention the tailwind. Not a one was ever even close and that was even using different props.

that is not what I'm saying roger, I'm saying the PHYSICAL adjustments for the PHYSICAL control rods are rigged to give the alerion more reflex in the factory -12 aircraft.

So you readjusted the flap to Alerion mixer after you set the flaps to -12? Or re rigged the aircraft?

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5 hours ago, Roger Lee said:

Just reset the flap potentiometer position to equal the flap position indicator on the panel. The potentiometer memory can be set to anything. Even the flap board in the panel has different indicator settings if you know how to access them.

Roger, 

 

Please re-read my posts, I am not talking about the settings on the flap control board. 

When you reprogram the flaps to be -12, are the alerions also physically going to be at -12 degrees?

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