Air Work

[Jim Meade]

I went out today to scratch some itches and maybe keep my flight envelope expanded.

 

Went to 3000 AGL and after clearing turns did some turns in both directions between 45° and 60° bank. Then a couple of simple, power-off stalls, straight ahead. Then 3-4 partial power-on stalls, none at full power, with various degrees of pitch up attitude. Did them slowly, playing with the rudder all the way. Then I did some mild wing overs. Pull up and let it drop off to the side, keep the ball centered till it's getting the nose down a ways. The SW is slick and will speed up quickly so one can't stay in it too long. Tried a couple of accelerated stalls and didn't do them as cleanly as I'd have liked.

 

What do you think about accelerated stalls? I get the feeling that the only reason to teach them is to demonstrate that an airplane will stall at a faster speed than we usually practice.

 

I flew to a local airport where I did a normal landing, slight crosswind, 40° flaps. Took it around the pattern and shut the engine off at the key point. 15° flaps and about 65 kias around the pattern. I don't fly square patterns. I fly the rounded pattern many glider pilots use. Ended up with 40° flaps and slipped it pretty hard, so you can tell that even at pattern altitude, I was a bit high and should have lost altitude faster.

 

Back on the way home, I decided to see about a trim stall. I do not recommend you practice a trim stall unless you are pretty comfortable. It's only required for a CFI. You set the plane up on approach, power off and trim the nose up quite aggressively. Then, you advance the throttle fully and pitch up as if you are doing a go around. If you don't keep a grip on the stick, the trim will take the nose up very high very quickly. You will have to hold considerable forward stick while you are rolling the trim out as quickly as you can. Do it at altitude if you are going to do it. Do it with your CFI if you feel you need to do one.

 

Back to 3,000 AGL, I decided to try some cross control work. Slow up like on approach, 15° flaps, turn like on base-final. Start putting inside rudder in while holding outside ailerone - classic mistake made by pilots who are overshooting final. I fooled around with this 3-4 times and never got it to break into a stall. I ended up with the rudder all the way to the floor, but I did not snap the stick to the outside. Maybe next time. I got some fast descent times but the plane always felt quite in hand. I have only done a cross-controlled stall a few times in a C-150. In each case, when the plane stalls, in a split second - instantly - you'd swear you'd swear you were looking stright down. You aren't, of course, but it is so sudden. Anyway, I didn't get anything near a stall. But, in the C-150, when it stalls it's a sudden snap, so I wouldn't say the SW wouldn't do the same thing if I can get it to do it.

 

Back to the home airport and a short field landing. 0,8 hours on the Hobbs. Lots of fun on a nice day to fly.

 

Have any of you completed a cross-controlled stall?

 

When you do power-on stalls, do you use full throttle? CAn you do so and keep the pitch to 30° or less, as the FAA requires, or does the nose have the ability to get higher if you let it?

 

The SW is slicker than most light planes I've flown, so I'm sticking my foot in one toe at a time. I'm going to work on power-on stalls, wing-overs, maybe push the cross-control stall a bit. I'm also working on short field work, as I have some ambitions in that direction.

 

 

[kevmor]

I usually do power on stalls around 4300 RPM or so, that way you don't get an excessive nose up pitch attitude.

[207WF]

I think if you read the FARS carefully, you will conclude that the FAA does not require you to keep the pitch angle under 30 degrees. WF

[kevmor]

I think if you read the FARS carefully, you will conclude that the FAA does not require you to keep the pitch angle under 30 degrees. WF

 

How do you mean?

[coppercity]

I teach/do them at full power as that is the power setting we depart and climb at. If we had a 600hp supercharged engine it might be different. The trick is to get the airspeed down to below 60 kts then start pitching up followed by full power. The stall will occur in a short amount of time and at around 20-25 deg nose up attitude. It's really very docile and easy even in turns. It's almost hard to perceive except for some slight porpoising.

[Doug G.]

Just don't go over 60° or you have to wear a parachute, don't think the BRS counts. (Not sure where you got the impression you are limited to 30°, the practical involves 45° steep turns.)

[FastEddieB]

The 30° limit was mentioned in regards to pitch, not bank.

[Doug G.]

What!? You mean I have to read ALL the words? Sorry. :-)

[knolde]

I went out today to scratch some itches and maybe keep my flight envelope expanded.

 

Went to 3000 AGL and after clearing turns did some turns in both directions between 45° and 60° bank. Then a couple of simple, power-off stalls, straight ahead. Then 3-4 partial power-on stalls, none at full power, with various degrees of pitch up attitude. Did them slowly, playing with the rudder all the way. Then I did some mild wing overs. Pull up and let it drop off to the side, keep the ball centered till it's getting the nose down a ways. The SW is slick and will speed up quickly so one can't stay in it too long. Tried a couple of accelerated stalls and didn't do them as cleanly as I'd have liked.

 

What do you think about accelerated stalls? I get the feeling that the only reason to teach them is to demonstrate that an airplane will stall at a faster speed than we usually practice.

 

I flew to a local airport where I did a normal landing, slight crosswind, 40° flaps. Took it around the pattern and shut the engine off at the key point. 15° flaps and about 65 kias around the pattern. I don't fly square patterns. I fly the rounded pattern many glider pilots use. Ended up with 40° flaps and slipped it pretty hard, so you can tell that even at pattern altitude, I was a bit high and should have lost altitude faster.

 

Back on the way home, I decided to see about a trim stall. I do not recommend you practice a trim stall unless you are pretty comfortable. It's only required for a CFI. You set the plane up on approach, power off and trim the nose up quite aggressively. Then, you advance the throttle fully and pitch up as if you are doing a go around. If you don't keep a grip on the stick, the trim will take the nose up very high very quickly. You will have to hold considerable forward stick while you are rolling the trim out as quickly as you can. Do it at altitude if you are going to do it. Do it with your CFI if you feel you need to do one.

 

Back to 3,000 AGL, I decided to try some cross control work. Slow up like on approach, 15° flaps, turn like on base-final. Start putting inside rudder in while holding outside ailerone - classic mistake made by pilots who are overshooting final. I fooled around with this 3-4 times and never got it to break into a stall. I ended up with the rudder all the way to the floor, but I did not snap the stick to the outside. Maybe next time. I got some fast descent times but the plane always felt quite in hand. I have only done a cross-controlled stall a few times in a C-150. In each case, when the plane stalls, in a split second - instantly - you'd swear you'd swear you were looking stright down. You aren't, of course, but it is so sudden. Anyway, I didn't get anything near a stall. But, in the C-150, when it stalls it's a sudden snap, so I wouldn't say the SW wouldn't do the same thing if I can get it to do it.

 

Back to the home airport and a short field landing. 0,8 hours on the Hobbs. Lots of fun on a nice day to fly.

 

Have any of you completed a cross-controlled stall?

 

When you do power-on stalls, do you use full throttle? CAn you do so and keep the pitch to 30° or less, as the FAA requires, or does the nose have the ability to get higher if you let it?

 

The SW is slicker than most light planes I've flown, so I'm sticking my foot in one toe at a time. I'm going to work on power-on stalls, wing-overs, maybe push the cross-control stall a bit. I'm also working on short field work, as I have some ambitions in that direction.

 

 

 

 

Jim: As adverse to stalling as I am, I decided it might be a good idea. Well everything went pretty much as expected and as I did not spin, I figure I did okay. However, on the third or fourth power on stall, I entered at 3000' AGL. 6 degrees of flap, 5100 rpm. As I started to pull the nose up I added full power and at about 30 degrees of pitch the climb went to zero and with a bit of wing waggle it mushed downward with the nose pretty high, there was no clear indication of the stall, but the airplane clearly stalled and it was simply a matter of forward stick to break the stall and continue on. I tried a cross controll stall (full rudder and aileron) with idle power and I got much the same response, nose high, a bit of wing waggle, and nose dropping, sorta mushing down stick forward, ailerons neutral, and rudder -- in this case neutral as we simply went straight ahead. My take away is that the CTLS is a dynamically stable aircraft and stalls are pretty mild.

 

I take stuff like stalling in the pattern seriously, so, for example, on any turns in the pattern I will repeat the mantra "speed and altitude are life!" "in the pattern add flap or pull off power get nose down" I know its trite, but I believe that not stalling is the best preventative. Of course, and there always is an "of course," strong gusty crosswinds can make life interesting. I figure that I have done sufficient stalling for a while.

 

See ya, Ken Nolde (N840KN)

[Ed Bandy]

I went out today to scratch some itches and maybe keep my flight envelope expanded.

 

Went to 3000 AGL and after clearing turns did some turns in both directions between 45° and 60° bank. Then a couple of simple, power-off stalls, straight ahead. Then 3-4 partial power-on stalls, none at full power, with various degrees of pitch up attitude. Did them slowly, playing with the rudder all the way. Then I did some mild wing overs. Pull up and let it drop off to the side, keep the ball centered till it's getting the nose down a ways. The SW is slick and will speed up quickly so one can't stay in it too long. Tried a couple of accelerated stalls and didn't do them as cleanly as I'd have liked.

 

What do you think about accelerated stalls? I get the feeling that the only reason to teach them is to demonstrate that an airplane will stall at a faster speed than we usually practice.

 

I flew to a local airport where I did a normal landing, slight crosswind, 40° flaps. Took it around the pattern and shut the engine off at the key point. 15° flaps and about 65 kias around the pattern. I don't fly square patterns. I fly the rounded pattern many glider pilots use. Ended up with 40° flaps and slipped it pretty hard, so you can tell that even at pattern altitude, I was a bit high and should have lost altitude faster.

 

Back on the way home, I decided to see about a trim stall. I do not recommend you practice a trim stall unless you are pretty comfortable. It's only required for a CFI. You set the plane up on approach, power off and trim the nose up quite aggressively. Then, you advance the throttle fully and pitch up as if you are doing a go around. If you don't keep a grip on the stick, the trim will take the nose up very high very quickly. You will have to hold considerable forward stick while you are rolling the trim out as quickly as you can. Do it at altitude if you are going to do it. Do it with your CFI if you feel you need to do one.

 

Back to 3,000 AGL, I decided to try some cross control work. Slow up like on approach, 15° flaps, turn like on base-final. Start putting inside rudder in while holding outside ailerone - classic mistake made by pilots who are overshooting final. I fooled around with this 3-4 times and never got it to break into a stall. I ended up with the rudder all the way to the floor, but I did not snap the stick to the outside. Maybe next time. I got some fast descent times but the plane always felt quite in hand. I have only done a cross-controlled stall a few times in a C-150. In each case, when the plane stalls, in a split second - instantly - you'd swear you'd swear you were looking stright down. You aren't, of course, but it is so sudden. Anyway, I didn't get anything near a stall. But, in the C-150, when it stalls it's a sudden snap, so I wouldn't say the SW wouldn't do the same thing if I can get it to do it.

 

Back to the home airport and a short field landing. 0,8 hours on the Hobbs. Lots of fun on a nice day to fly.

 

Have any of you completed a cross-controlled stall?

 

When you do power-on stalls, do you use full throttle? CAn you do so and keep the pitch to 30° or less, as the FAA requires, or does the nose have the ability to get higher if you let it?

 

The SW is slicker than most light planes I've flown, so I'm sticking my foot in one toe at a time. I'm going to work on power-on stalls, wing-overs, maybe push the cross-control stall a bit. I'm also working on short field work, as I have some ambitions in that direction.

 

I have as a Sport CFI with a DPE, flown into a Cross Controlled Stall. It was a non event since we were planning it, but if caught off guard it would be a tense time. We had to cross her up, bring the nose way up, then hold it there..the wing stalled, the stabilator stalled, the nose fell through.. only airfoil left flying was the vertical stab which made the airplane go that direction of input. We did not add power, rather let the CTSW build up speed and just fly out of it. We did a couple of these each direction. Do not attempt without plenty of air below you and with a good instructor along. Take spin training and unusual attitudes early in your career, best money you will invest.

[Winger]

A cross-control stall (rudder and aileron opposite each other) if you press it to an extreme, is a SPIN entry technique. I would never do these in the pattern at low altitude, but carefully practice them at a safe altitude if you want to explore the limits of this.

[Doug G.]

The accelerated stall is an FD non-approved maneuver for the CTLS.