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Odyssey Battery PC310 Cheap

CT4ME

By CT4ME
in Engine/Rotax

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CT4ME

CT4ME

Posted
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With all the talk about battery life and such, I've decided to pro-actively replace mine. After all, it is about 7 years old, and has never had a lick of "maintenance". Still works great... but....

I found the Odyssey PC310 for $120, plus $9 shipping. 1 year warranty. I'm told this is a very good price, and thought I'd pass the info on...

ApexBattery.com

Tim

NOTE: wow... extra 5% for using coupon code apex5 or eb5.... that makes the battery $114

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Runtoeat

Runtoeat

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I've read that the AGM batteries can have a very long shelf life before being sold and they are still OK. I've left my battery maintainer (CTEK 3300) detached for a couple of weeks and when I connect it, it immediately goes to "green". They can sit a very long time without loosing very much voltage.

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CT4ME

CT4ME

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'Never, ever, externally charged mine in about 7 years. The two times I thought I should put it on the Battery Tender it went to green after a a few moments. In those instances, it had been setting for 2 months. Rock Solid.

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Roger Lee

Roger Lee

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Tim has all analog gauges. All the digital panels I have checked all have some slight battery drain when sitting. I just went to battery #3 a few days ago. it wasn't dead, but was turning pretty slow. Without the soft start setup it probably wouldn't have started. That's only 2 batteries in 7 years.

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C ICEY

C ICEY

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just put in my second replacement (third) battery in ten years this summer. ~1100hrs

steam gauges, + a garmin 196

 

should have done it last summer, because hard starts last winter led to a burned out spragg clutch

ouch.

learned lots, though! :unsure:

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Roger Lee

Roger Lee

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Prop kickbacks and long hard starts are sprag killers. If the battery starts to get low and starts are hard change out the battery. If the weather makes starting hard this will kill a sprag. Get an engine pre-heater.

 

As Icey found it it isn't cheap to fix a sprag. The engine comes out, the engine comes out of the mount and someone with technical knowledge of the Rotax and special tools needs to do the replacement.

 

Don't let it get to that point just because of a battery or cold weather.

 

Common causes of kickback:

1-Engine mount design that allows the engine and carbs to shake at start-up causing poor atomization of the fuel and raw fuel in the intake manifold. (airbox should have been mandatory for the 100hp 912S/ULS as it helps to stabilize the carbs).

2-Poor starting technique.

3-Incorrect idle setting.

4-Loose gearbox.

5- Bad or weak starter (like the old black starter wasn't as up to the task as well as the newer higher torque stater that has now been around many years.

6- Weak battery causing the pilot to use excessive cranking.

 

 

If you have the old starter which no CT has.

Installing the higher torque starter can help. It has a gold colored case verses the older starters black case.It can make starting a little easier and have to crank a little less which translates to less long term wear.

 

Then once a great while there is some unexplained wear problem that just happens because humans built it or didn't hardened the metals quite right.

 

The above things that people do to their engine don't cause immediate issues, but like smoking give it a little time and it will cause problems and they usually aren't cheap.It's hard to tell some people that they are harming their engine when it seems to run fine. It's just doing damage slowly so an owner can't see the immediate problem so it's hard to convince some. Doing things the right way up front even though it seems to cost a little more saves tons of money in the long run.

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Ed Cesnalis

Ed Cesnalis

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Jim,

 

I think for me with an older 912ULS starting in general is harder due to my flywheel with its harder ignition start setting. Even instant starts are hard and when there is a lot of cranking and multiple attempts there are just more kicks. I now have a fresh sprag clutch, new Tanis pre-heater, new battery and a tender and a different prop without the nickel leading edge.

 

It always starts in an instant now but the hard starts that I get make me hope this clutch will last till TBO.

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Jim Meade

Jim Meade

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Jacques, interesting discussion.

I wonder if kickback is similar in effect to detonation? It sounds like the mixture fires before it should.

Kickback must generate forces that are in excess of what the sprag clutch is rated for, if it will damage the sprag clutch. It's somewhat similar to a prop strike, that sometimes not so violent.

 

From Roger's comments:

I don't see how a long, hard start by itself hurts the sprag clutch. Maybe the effect mighht.

Kickback must be more than the sprag clutch is rated for to damage it

Excessive cranking doesn't directly cause kickback but might get the engine turning too slowly and result in firing at too slow a speed, which might cause kickback.

 

Does that sound right?

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Jim Meade

Jim Meade

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So, I see that Seaton defines kickback not as a reverse direction of the prop caused by premature ignition but rather is a failure of the sprag clutch to properly engage. I had an incorrect understanding of the term "kickback". I'm going to have to think about how the Rotex sprag clutches work. I have sprag clutches on my farm tractors and have replaced them. I know what they look like and how they function. I've seen the Rotax version in schools.

 

So if kickback causes sprag clutch failures and is caused by the failure of a sprag clutch, then we are saying that a worn sprag clutch is the cause of a worn sprag clutch.

 

Here is what I object to in these discussions. We get lots of advice and strong urgings to do certain things. There is no doubt in my mind that many of the recommendations are based on both school and experience. But, what we too often don't get is an explanation.

 

Witness the difference between this discussion and Chanic's observations on the voltage regulator.

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Roger Lee

Roger Lee

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In general and simple terms,

 

For those that don't know where a sprag clutch is in our Rotax it is located in the starter area. It is basically a spring with round metal inserts in the spring's circumference. When the prop and or starter turns the correct way these metal inserts engage the the engine side and starts to turn the engine over and as the engine starts and passes a certain rpm the spring and metal inserts dis-engage and relax. Turning a prop backward or getting the prop to kick backward stretches the spring and eventually it will not engage in the proper direction any longer. To fix this the engine has to come off. The engine mount comes off. The entire rear housing comes off with special tools just to get to the sprag.

Kickback can occur even if the sprag engages normally, but momentarily and then something interrupts that rotation and it literally goes in reverse. When the prop goes into reverse it stretches the spring. Even during shut down engines have been know to run backward for 2-3 revolutions.The causes we listed are all culprits.

 

There are really two reasons not to rotate the prop backward. One sucks in air into the system, but the other is it stretches the sprag.

 

To get into specific details and documentation for all the forums we answer on we would be at the computer 24/7 and need assistants. We try to encourage owners to research because it helps learn where to find answers for other questions. It stays with the person longer and then they tend to actually believe what we tell them. So some items just get a straight answer and no detailed explanation and then many times the question may be too vague to give anything more than a brief answer.

 

Getting a full detailed question that covers enough specifics rarely happens.

 

Even terminology has its barriers. Terms get interchanged like overload clutch and slipper clutch or 912S when they really meant 912ULS or even UL. So reading between the lines or deciphering can be a challenge at times. It isn't anyone's fault on either side of the coin just lack of experience or schooling some times. It usually just means more emails to sort through the issue and then something may get misinterpreted due to lack of info.

 

Rob Seaton at Rotech in Canada is a very knowledgeable person.

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CT4ME

CT4ME

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I ordered another one, for a different CT, Monday. This time I took advantage of their $40 upgraded 2 year warranty. That way I figure about 4 years of battery coverage...

 

FWIW... the battery I'm replacing lasted about two years, in a glass-panel CT that wasn't flown much... especially in the last several months.

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