CT4ME Posted June 27, 2014 Report Posted June 27, 2014 The July 2014 issue of Flying Magazine has a cover story labeled "Revolution - 5 Planes that will change aviation". The upcoming Flight Design C4 is one of those planes. The article is not available online (yet). The others: Icon A5 (surprise), Pilatus PC-24, Pipistrel Panthera, and Aerion AS2. Of course, they're not perfect. Last year at this time they had the article about "Rising Stars - the top Light Sport Aircraft". In it, they predicted the Cessna SkyCatcher would be around "for the long haul". Tim
Doug G. Posted June 28, 2014 Report Posted June 28, 2014 I love my CT, but "best plane ever built" is a bit of a stretch. That is not only subjective, but mission dependent.
Tom Baker Posted June 28, 2014 Report Posted June 28, 2014 I love my CT, but "best plane ever built" is a bit of a stretch. That is not only subjective, but mission dependent. I think that was said with a we bit of sarcasm. I know we don't have that around here often.
Anticept Posted June 28, 2014 Report Posted June 28, 2014 I love my CT, but "best plane ever built" is a bit of a stretch. That is not only subjective, but mission dependent. It is a stretch, because MY CT is the best plane ever built <3
Doug G. Posted June 29, 2014 Report Posted June 29, 2014 I think it would have been terrible as a bomber escort in WWII.
FastEddieB Posted June 29, 2014 Report Posted June 29, 2014 All planes are compromises. It's absurd to put one plane in the vaunted position of "best". At least without context. My Sky Arrow excels in some areas, and suffers in others. So do the current CT's. So will the C4. Which is not even finalized yet. BTW, 100Hamburger's posts seem to have a familiar ring. Is it someone who's posted here before?
Anticept Posted June 29, 2014 Report Posted June 29, 2014 I think it would have been terrible as a bomber escort in WWII. Of course! Doesn't change the fact I love my baby to death. So she's still the best plane ever built! BTW, 100Hamburger's posts seem to have a familiar ring. Is it someone who's posted here before? http://ctflier.com/index.php?app=members&module=profile§ion=dname&id=940
FastEddieB Posted June 29, 2014 Report Posted June 29, 2014 http://ctflier.com/index.php?app=members&module=profile§ion=dname&id=940 Thanks! Then the obvious next question is... ...why?
Ed Cesnalis Posted June 29, 2014 Report Posted June 29, 2014 The exaggeration is what some of us react to. 175kts?
Tom Baker Posted June 29, 2014 Report Posted June 29, 2014 Do we have someone being paranoid and deleting their post, or is someone doing it for them?
Doug G. Posted June 29, 2014 Report Posted June 29, 2014 Of course! Doesn't change the fact I love my baby to death. So she's still the best plane ever built! http://ctflier.com/index.php?app=members&module=profile§ion=dname&id=940 Hyperbole is acceptable for each individual's plane.
FastEddieB Posted June 29, 2014 Report Posted June 29, 2014 Seriously, hyperbole is murdering us all!
Tom Baker Posted June 29, 2014 Report Posted June 29, 2014 I deleted mine because 100Hamburgers deleted his making mine irrelevant. I didn't realize you had deleted post too. My post was not directed at you.
Doug G. Posted June 29, 2014 Report Posted June 29, 2014 Eddie, you are right. Hyperbole will certainly bring the end of civilization as we know it!
FastEddieB Posted June 29, 2014 Report Posted June 29, 2014 'best plane ever made' is not the premise, but if FD gets near their $250k benchmark price, and the plane performs at or above these specs, can anyone else make a case for any other four-seater contending for this niche? Aye, there's the rub. It's almost a truism that planes come in slower, heavier and more expensive than first projected. In 2003 I went through this as I was dreaming of a Diamond TwinStar. Ended up with a Cirrus instead, and very glad I did - the TwinStar was delayed and delayed and then went through horrendous engine problems. The Cirrus SR20 would seem comparable to the C4, and even with economies of scale they start at around $275,000. A C172 is about the same. Let's hope FD can hold the line and hit their projected price point. Color me skeptical - yet hopeful.
Tom Baker Posted June 29, 2014 Report Posted June 29, 2014 I will say that if the numbers come out anywhere close to those projected it should be a good airplane. I think you would be hard pressed to find another 4 place aircraft that will fly 4 200 pounders in comfort nonstop from Chicago to Florida, and just burning 10 GPH.
FlyingMonkey Posted June 30, 2014 Report Posted June 30, 2014 With a CTLSi hitting $160k+, as a smaller airframe *without* having to meet Part 23 certification requirements, I too am a little worried that a 4 seat certified FD airplane can hit their target price point. I hope so, but seems difficult. If they pull it off and the airplane is good, it will sell very well I'd guess.
S4Flier Posted June 30, 2014 Report Posted June 30, 2014 Tecnam announced their 4 seater around 3 years ago with a G1000 equipped target price of $250K. Cruise was projected at 140+kts, MTOW 2557lbs and useful load around 1000lbs. From their website today, the P2010 with glass lists at $335K and 75% cruise is 133kts (maximum 140kts). Weight specs are the same. My guess is that the C4 will be somewhere north of $250K and real-world performance will be a bit less than the original announcements. Both will still be $100K (or more) less than C172 with much better performance.
CT4ME Posted June 30, 2014 Author Report Posted June 30, 2014 I hope the C4 moves through the prototyping and certification quickly, but that's something that takes whatever time it takes. The P2010 prototype first flew a little over a year ago, and their second prototype was flying earlier this year. Yet they still haven't gained certification.
FastEddieB Posted July 1, 2014 Report Posted July 1, 2014 As an aside, the Cirrus jet, then called "theJet", was unveiled at the 2008 Cirrus Migration. I was there with Karen, and there was a lot of excitement. 6 years later, still not certified. These things always take longer than one imagines.
frfly172 Posted July 1, 2014 Report Posted July 1, 2014 Have to agree ,that if they come close to their numbers,the ct4 will be a real competitor. Especially if they do away with the medical requirement.
Doug G. Posted July 1, 2014 Report Posted July 1, 2014 Cirrus went through a buyout (Chinese) in the process. The HondaJet seems closer.
FastEddieB Posted July 1, 2014 Report Posted July 1, 2014 Cirrus went through a buyout (Chinese) in the process. True, but it was hoped that the infusion of capital would speed up, rather than delay, the jet. Cirrus is a prime example of how hard it is to actually make money selling planes. They were apparently cranking our more GA planes than anyone and still losing money. Alan Klapmeir, one of the founders, is now behind Kestrel. Lots of folks remain skeptical of that venture now, as well.
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