F4 update

[Mike Koerner]

Flight Design has updated the status of the F4 (https://flightdesign.com/flight-design-f4-aero2023). It will have the new Rotax 916 engine. First flight will be the end of this year with certification in fall of 2024.

A cabin width of 134 cm = 53 in. That compares to 49 in for our CTs, an extra 2 inches of shoulder room per person.

The fuel consumption of 30 l/hr = 7.9 gal/hr.

The range of 1400 km = 755 nm = 870 sm.

At a cruise speed of 145 kts that’s 5.2 hr of flight time. Assuming 30 min VFR reserve, that’s 5.7 hrs of fuel. At 7.9 gal/hr, that’s 45 gal usable fuel. At 6 lb/gal, that’s 270 lbs of fuel.

A payload of 450 kg = 992 lb. Assuming 4 passengers at 170 lb, that still leaves 312 lb for baggage, 78 lb per passenger, compared to 55 lb per passenger for our CTs. This assumes they really meant to say “payload”. Remember there are translations involved. If they meant “usable load”, with 4 passsengers at 170 lb and full fuel, you would be left with a total of 42 lb for baggage, 10.5 lb per person.

400 T€ = $440.000 at today’s exchange rate.

[tevbax]

Now, the question is whether or not this will fall under MOSAIC. Through my conversation with multiple manufacturers, Jack Pelton (EAA), and others, it sounds like sport pilots will have some aircraft as well as privledge opportunities. 

Let's hope they do it right. 

[Warmi]

Light Sport was not just about making flying available to Sport Pilots in terms of simplified certification process ( mainly related to medical issues ) but also about making aviation more affordable , at least in the sense of being affordable to what we would consider as upper middle class - a $500K plane is well beyond that and is just another entry in the market of hand crafted luxury items for multi-millionaires.

[tevbax]

While I do not disagree with you on cost of entry, light sport has really gone in two directions. On one side, you have the simple steam gauge easy to operate airplane. On the other side, you have the plus 87kt easy to operate speedster with a modern panel. Both fit the easy operation niche, but the price difference is HUGE! I do like that there are options, and that sport pilots aren't limited to a Geo Metro of the skies. 

The CT fits somewhere in the middle, and as other companies have discovered, there is a market for a premium product. 

 

[Towner]

The F4 sounds like an awesome personal airplane, but the price makes me wonder about its success. I know I can’t afford it! Initially, new LSA’s were supposed to be under $100k. It seems those days are long gone. Even a new CT is out of my price range.

Also, I think it’s gonna need to have at least some success as a trainer, or even in flight clubs. When you can get a new 172 or PA28 for the same costs, I think the F4 will struggle breaking into this area. At least until it proves it’s durability as a trainer. I’m guessing a lot of the larger outfits will keep using Cessna and Piper because they are proven and something A&Ps are very familiar with. And with Mosaic, the Cessnas and Pipers may be available for sport pilots in the future.

Still sounds like a great personal airplane though. I really hope it’s successful.

[Warmi]

8 hours ago, tevbax said:

While I do not disagree with you on cost of entry, light sport has really gone in two directions. On one side, you have the simple steam gauge easy to operate airplane. On the other side, you have the plus 87kt easy to operate speedster with a modern panel. Both fit the easy operation niche, but the price difference is HUGE! I do like that there are options, and that sport pilots aren't limited to a Geo Metro of the skies. 

The CT fits somewhere in the middle, and as other companies have discovered, there is a market for a premium product. 

 

Yes, I was basically saying “I can maybe afford a 200k plane if I really , really try but no way in hell a 500k plane”  …without actually saying it

[Adriaan Strauss]

Are there any updates on the F4, when will it be available for ordering, waiting list and price?

Adriaan Strauss

South Africa