Belt13 Posted September 13, 2019 Report Share Posted September 13, 2019 I think my CTsw 2005 needs a new re-pack or the whole BRS looked at as I don't see anything being done on it the last 7 years at least according to the journey log book. Does anyone know how and who can do this and how much does it cost? I've read about $1500 to repack. I'm in Canada , do you send it out , do you take it to a shop? This is new to me and some advice would be great and thank you. Belt13 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlyingMonkey Posted September 13, 2019 Report Share Posted September 13, 2019 If it's a 2005 and the BRS has never been serviced, you'll need a repack and a rocket replacement. That's probably going to be close to $3k. That's what I'm looking at this winter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brudy Posted September 30, 2019 Report Share Posted September 30, 2019 I sent my Parachute in, and the cost was $2,675.00 for the canister, rocket, repack, not including the certified mechanic to pull it out. NOTE: the 2 weeks and it will be done quote from BRS has a qualifier "add 1 week for shipping to and 1 week to ship back for a total of 4 weeks. Mine was due to ship back last week on the BRS time schedule and I haven't heard from BRS, No return calls, No return email. Payment in full was sent at least 2 weeks ago or longer. Not Happy! Also the aircraft is not legally flyable with out the Parachute So my aircraft is grounded. Not Nice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnyjr Posted October 1, 2019 Report Share Posted October 1, 2019 Is it in fact true the the plane is not airworthy without the BRS installed? Anyone know why that is, weight and balance perhaps? Is it not airworthy with an expired BRS either? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlyingMonkey Posted October 1, 2019 Report Share Posted October 1, 2019 8 hours ago, johnnyjr said: Is it in fact true the the plane is not airworthy without the BRS installed? Anyone know why that is, weight and balance perhaps? Is it not airworthy with an expired BRS either? True if it's an S-LSA, the BRS is required equipment. I think you can get factory permission to fly to/from the mechanic to do the BRS work, but that's it. If your airplane is an E-LSA, you can do what you want. Personally, I think not flying for a few weeks is not a huge hardship, considering the lifesaving potential of the BRS system. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnyjr Posted October 1, 2019 Report Share Posted October 1, 2019 Is this the case for rockets past their expiration as well, or just uninstalled equipment? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlyingMonkey Posted October 1, 2019 Report Share Posted October 1, 2019 23 minutes ago, johnnyjr said: Is this the case for rockets past their expiration as well, or just uninstalled equipment? It's a maintenance item specified by Flight Design, so technically it's not legal to fly if not complied with. So if the chute or rocket is expired, you are not legal to to fly whether the system is installed in the airplane or not. My airplane is an ELSA and I'm going to do a rocket and repack. I will probably wait until February and do it in the dead of winter when I do my annual. That will put me a couple of months late for it, but I'm sure if the system works at 12 months it will work at 14 months, and I probably won't be doing much flying those two months anyway. But I have the latitude to do that because of my airplane's ELSA status. With an SLSA you are really locked into whatever maintenance the manufacturer specifies, with no wiggle room. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Baker Posted October 1, 2019 Report Share Posted October 1, 2019 First off let me preface this with I think it would be foolish to plan extended operations with the parachute expired or removed. Andy, I think you are wrong. The parachute is not required equipment. For the CTSW there is no list of required equipment in the AOI. For the CTLS there is a minimum list and the parachute is not on the list, but it is on the recommended equipment list. Second the parachute is not even listed in the inspection checklist for condition inspection. Based on these two facts it is my opinion that it would not be illegal, just foolish, to operate that aircraft past the expiration date of the parachute. Now removing the parachute is a completely different matter, because that is a modification to the way the airplane was delivered, thus requiring documentation of the change. That is why Flight Design has a MRA for removal of the parachute. Operation of the aircraft with the chute removed would have to be in compliance with what is allowed by the MRA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlyingMonkey Posted October 1, 2019 Report Share Posted October 1, 2019 Isn't the maintenance interval for the parachute specified in the airplane docs, and doesn't that make it regulatory for an SLSA, just like the two year wing pull? I was not basing my comments on a list of required equipment, but on specified factory maintenance intervals. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Baker Posted October 1, 2019 Report Share Posted October 1, 2019 Doing a word search of the PDF of the maintenance manual for both the CTLS and CTSW, shows only one place where the parachute is mentioned. That says beware of accidental activation of the rocket while working on the aircraft. There is no maintenance of the parachute mentioned in the MM, or condition inspection checklist. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnyjr Posted October 1, 2019 Report Share Posted October 1, 2019 Thank you all for your replies. By no means am I looking to be foolish in any way. I did want to understand what the "rules" are so that I know where we. For example, seeing it's taking about 4 weeks round trip for repack/rocket replacement. I wanted to understand whether I could fly over to the mechanics field for removal, then return the place back to to my home field for other work to be completed by the avionics shop while the BRS is out, then return for the reinstall and my annual condition inspection. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Baker Posted October 1, 2019 Report Share Posted October 1, 2019 http://flightdesignusa.com/support/resources/ See the MRA for the major repair for removing the BRS for maintenance. It allows for flying the aircraft. You must update the equipment list and figure the new weight and balance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Runtoeat Posted October 2, 2019 Report Share Posted October 2, 2019 Andy and Tom, this situation with the 'chute is similar to engine TBO. Tom is correct in that we have no equipment list in our AOI for our CT's. Another section we do not have is a Operating Limitations Section. The ALS is a section that can be found on many certified aircraft which contains "mandatory" parts replacement or maintenance which has been approved by the FAA. Once an aircraft has been certified, there can be no changes made to the ALS, or if there was no ALS when originally certified, there can be no ALS added without FAA approval and/or a FAA AD issued which mandates the maintenance or change. This change, if made, cannot impact those aircraft already certified but applies only to aircraft certified after the changes made to the ALS. IMHO and based on research I've done by contacting FAA in Washington, D.C. the parachute repack, rocket replacement, rubber change, wing inspection, etc., are "recommendations" but are not mandatory. We do have the option to use "on condition" maintenance on our SLSA aircraft which is done by a certified A&P or LSRM. For the parachute, I totally agree that it is best to follow the recommendations of the experts regarding this piece of equipment and I will comply with the repack and rocket replacement recommendations. I believe that the Yearly (or 100 hour whichever comes first) conditional inspection is required by the FAA in the LSA rules and is something the owner/operator of a FD aircraft must carry out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sandpiper Posted October 6, 2019 Report Share Posted October 6, 2019 The following is a heads up for those coming up on a BRS repack and rocket replace. It is also me getting this off my chest. Just prior to August 27th I sent my chute to BRS via FedEx. I like to use FedEx since one of my daughters and her husband are both heavy equipment operators for them. This was $150 which included $6K insurance. Other than the receipt I got when I took it to FedEx, and an August 27th acknowledgement that it was enroute and that the delivery date was "pending", I have received no other information from FedEx. On September 3rd I received an email from BRS acknowledging receipt and an invoice for $2,525. BRS said the expected return shipping date was September 20. I paid the invoice the next day. On Friday September 27th and Monday September 30th, I placed several calls to BRS but received no response until the morning of Tuesday October 1st. Apparently there were several people that had been out sick so there were some delays. Perfectly understandable. They said my BRS had been at FedEx since Friday September 27th and should be on its way. As of today, October 5th, I've heard nothing further. To me, this is strange since my previous experiences with UPS, USPS and FedEX all included tracking numbers and notices updating delivery information - I think. So, for all of you coming up on a repack & rocket it looks like you can expect at least a 6 week down time. Hopefully you can plan a time that will have the least impact on your aviating. For me, having just had back surgery, it's no big deal. Can't fly anyway.Even so, it is frustrating. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sandpiper Posted October 7, 2019 Report Share Posted October 7, 2019 Parachute and rocket received together today. So, count on six weeks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Runtoeat Posted October 10, 2019 Report Share Posted October 10, 2019 John, not clear if hold up on receipt by BRS was due to them not being in shop to receive the 'chute or if Fed Ex was slow in delivering? Wondering if UPS may be a better choice? Is UPS able to ship our 'chute? Has anyone used UPS? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Baker Posted October 10, 2019 Report Share Posted October 10, 2019 1 hour ago, Runtoeat said: John, not clear if hold up on receipt by BRS was due to them not being in shop to receive the 'chute or if Fed Ex was slow in delivering? Wondering if UPS may be a better choice? Is UPS able to ship our 'chute? Has anyone used UPS? I always ship out UPS, but BRS has always shipped back FedEx. I expect it has something to do with the hazardous materials when shipping the rocket. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sandpiper Posted October 12, 2019 Report Share Posted October 12, 2019 (edited) On 10/10/2019 at 4:14 AM, Runtoeat said: John, not clear if hold up on receipt by BRS was due to them not being in shop to receive the 'chute or if Fed Ex was slow in delivering? Wondering if UPS may be a better choice? Is UPS able to ship our 'chute? Has anyone used UPS? Dick, don't know the answers. In my case I have family flying for FedEx so I try to support the company. And, no, I don't get a break. I don't even ask. Edited October 12, 2019 by sandpiper grammar Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Animosity2k Posted October 12, 2019 Report Share Posted October 12, 2019 I shipped via UPS and received back via FedEx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sandpiper Posted October 12, 2019 Report Share Posted October 12, 2019 4 hours ago, Animosity2k said: I shipped via UPS and received back via FedEx How long were you without the BRS? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Animosity2k Posted October 14, 2019 Report Share Posted October 14, 2019 On 10/12/2019 at 2:24 PM, sandpiper said: How long were you without the BRS? I overnight it to BRS on a Friday, they had confirmed receipt on Monday. I think they had it for a total of 10 days and it was back at my FBO being installed. Way quicker than I had expected. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Runtoeat Posted October 14, 2019 Report Share Posted October 14, 2019 John, are you in a rural location in Oregon and could this be a factor for long delivery times? I'm also wondering if you may have hit a bad period due to illnesses and vacations? It took BRS from 9/3 to 9/27 to turn the 'chute around, about a week longer than their original estimate of 9/20. Then, it took Fed-Ex 10 days to ship it back to you, from 9/27 to 10/7. Doesn't sound like a huge delay either at BRS or Fed-Ex . Animosity, you "overnite" shipped to BRS. Not sure if it came back also "overnite"? If I read correctly, your time from receipt at BRS to receiving it back was 10 days. So, 4 days shipping to BRS + 10 days (includes time at BRS plus shipping back to you?) = 14 days? I'm trying to schedule a time this winter to get my 'chute repacked which will keep me grounded for a minimum amount of time. I'd like to start a new entry on our forum "Total days for BRS 'Chute Repack" to see what others are experiencing for the BRS repack. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sandpiper Posted October 14, 2019 Report Share Posted October 14, 2019 Dick, I live about 10 miles west of Salem, Oregon so don't consider myself to be in a very rural area. So, don't know what factors may have been involved. Sickness at BRS sounds like that was at least part of the delay. If you have a choice try to avoid the period between Thanksgiving and New Years. I know FedEx is always really busy then and some companies shut down for a week or two for Christmas. Good luck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Animosity2k Posted October 15, 2019 Report Share Posted October 15, 2019 On 10/14/2019 at 11:20 AM, Runtoeat said: John, are you in a rural location in Oregon and could this be a factor for long delivery times? I'm also wondering if you may have hit a bad period due to illnesses and vacations? It took BRS from 9/3 to 9/27 to turn the 'chute around, about a week longer than their original estimate of 9/20. Then, it took Fed-Ex 10 days to ship it back to you, from 9/27 to 10/7. Doesn't sound like a huge delay either at BRS or Fed-Ex . Animosity, you "overnite" shipped to BRS. Not sure if it came back also "overnite"? If I read correctly, your time from receipt at BRS to receiving it back was 10 days. So, 4 days shipping to BRS + 10 days (includes time at BRS plus shipping back to you?) = 14 days? I'm trying to schedule a time this winter to get my 'chute repacked which will keep me grounded for a minimum amount of time. I'd like to start a new entry on our forum "Total days for BRS 'Chute Repack" to see what others are experiencing for the BRS repack. Yes 14 days in total from Door to Door. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Runtoeat Posted October 16, 2019 Report Share Posted October 16, 2019 Thanks for replies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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